Fun Fact #2: Left handed people have a shorter life expectancy than right handed people due to accidents involving equipment designed for right handed people

More war, less jobs! More war, less jobs! More war, Less jobs!

The worst part of it is that you were probably one of those people who supported the war to begin with, but as soon as the going got tough you “became enlightened” and realized that GW Bush actually misled you.

You talk about facing the negative effects of actions…. well apparently you have no desire to think about the negative consequences resulting from a premature evacuation of Iraq.

This may sound callous, but why should I be subtly manipulated to mourn for our military when the people who sent them to war don’t give a rats anything about them in the first place.

I would much rather the war didn’t occur in the first place…but I suppose we need something to stimulate/crash the economy…

I think this one is funny and represents Bush’s duplicitous attitude…

How much tim do you think our enemies would take to decide whether to invade us if it weren’t for the brave soldiers like Ms. Sus’ four sons, huh? They defend America EVERY DAY, whether you see it on the front page of the NY Times or not. You should be eternally grateful, lolo, that there are courageous individual who HAVE (pardon me, Ms. Sus) the BALLS to do the job of defending ALL this great nation’s citizens, including those lacking the intellect and courtesty of appreciating it.

Best conversation i’ve had yet. Thanks.

I completely disagree that our rights are privileges. They are categorically NOT privileges. They are *RIGHTS.* Privileges are given by authority figures, rights are inherent. If it’s a privilege of free speech, then it can be taken away on a whim. That is NOT what the founding fathers intended.

Oh horrible nation of killers… you’re correct, they (who is “they” anyway? Is this actually a quote from someone?) HAVE completely ignored all the good things the people of this nation have done. However, they are free to do so, and you are free to correct them by making fun of them or by calmly refuting their claims.

I don’t feel that other countries enter into it because we’re talking about the Constitution of the US here. Why should I care that you’re not allowed to dissent from the Gov’t Line in North Korea or Cuba? I’m not there. I hope that someday NK and Cuba WILL have the same rights as we do, but that is not my direct concern.

I wish the posting system here were more robust, I can’t see half of what I type, , can’t preview it before posting, and can’t edit it later! Argh!

I’m not a lawyer, and I’m probably getting this somewhat wrong, but that’s the way I understand it. I have thought the issue all the way through, but in general I don’t think I agree with any kind of “hate enhancement. A crime is a crime and should be dealt with as that crime, regardless of motive. On that note, there are so many laws on the books already, it is almost never needed to pass a new law criminalizing some kind of behavior. What is really needed is to enforce the laws that are already on the books, or else get rid of the la (which I don’t think happens often enough).

Well, this message is getting to be more of a pointless ramble than a response to you, so…

While voltaire´s philosphy is noble, I´m not quick to agree with it completely, yet again I won´t disagree with it. I´ve heard it before but now I feel like thinking about it.

The problem really is that their is no happy middle ground. Your either free to say whatever you want and it can get out of hand, or you are forbidden of speaking your mind and you are under a dictator. I´ll admit I´m a little dillusioned because I want there to be a happy middle ground so bad but it just doesn´t exist…..sigh……

Oh horrible nation of killers

I just completely disagree with that statement. It´s like they´´ve completely ignored all the nice people they´ve met and assumed that the world has gone to shit and everyone in thsi nation likes guns and likes shooting people. The few idiots that get that kind of media attention make the rest look bad.

How is other countries without the rights we have irrelvant to the arguement? It´s not, they are an example of why you should cherish your right instead assume that you should automatically have it causeyour a human being….crap that does open up a pandoras box, but honestly I see our rights more as priviledge, not things giving toyou just because your alive.

´Just like americans blah blah blah´

What an ingnorant statement. I know you´d change that if you took the oppurtunity to get to some on a personal level, and not the ones drunk on vacation walking the streets and acting like idiots.

I don´t like what you had to say at the end, because that is a complete generalization and you know better then to do that. I won´t go into personal stories of soliders and why they joined.

Lastly, even if they went to the same schools you did for education, and had the same information, many of these individuals grow up completely different from you. The goal is to first listen to where the person comes from, and then make the judgement of what you think your view is. Because I grew up 30 mins outside the most segregated city in the Northern US, with a murder rate higher then Chicagos, I have seen racial issues, I have been invovled in voluteer issues and so on. I say all that to say that someone who has grown up in a town where racial issues are no present probably doesn´t have the perspective or understand that I do, but while that is a guess, it is not a judgement and I go and talk to this person about the issues I feel informed on. Once we have a long talk about whatever issue we feel is important I either inform them about thing sI know, they inform me about things I don´t know, or we both find middle ground and continue to make a stronger bond. That comes from sit down conversations, which I KNOW you´d agree that such things are a rarity and need to happen more.

I´m smiling, I dont know why!

A: They’re fighting to secure freedom and security for the Iraqi people. Not for oil, or whatever other shit you’ve got yourself believing.

B: What would happen to your security and freedom if all those terrorists (oh, I’m sorry, ‘freedom fighters’) decided they’d had enough of the west, and came over here and killed another couple thousand people?

C: I hope to god there’s a draft. Just so you can be one of those young fools. There’s only one way to stop wars: kill everyone who will harm your country. End of story.

I agree that the WBC is reprehensible for what they do. If I were there, I would go give them a piece of my mind (but I would not physically attack them — that is exactly what they want so they could sue me and get money). However, I believe that they have a right to be there. Their right to speak should not be limited just because it’s a funeral, provided they are not trespassing or breaking any other laws in doing so. (btw, I thought you right wingers didn’t agree with there being separate “hate speech” laws — which I kind of agree with). Anyway, I agree with (Voltaire?) who said something like “Sir, I find what you say reprehensible, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.” I don’t think that *anything* (within the aforementioned limitations) should be off-limits. It’s not my right not to be offended.
I also disagree with your “horrible nations of killers and evils” thing. What other countries would do to you if you said that is not at all relevant in my opinion. Again, I would err on the side of allowing more speech, than repressing speech.
Protesting at soldiers’ funerals is horrible and I would never do it, but I believe that it should not be forbidden. Is it OK to praise soldiers at their funerals? Is it OK to *SARCASTICALLY* praise soldiers at their funerals? How do you tell the difference?
I also appreciate that we can (occasionally) have a serious discussion here.

The least far-fetched interpretation is that soldiers are dying for the Iraqi people and its freedom. However I have ethical issues with this kind of unsolicited liberation, particularly if it is poorly planned and executed so that as a result 100.000s have died.

I do not see my point of view as inherently better than that of the soldiers with a similar level of education and information on these issues. I am pretty sure that such soldiers by and large agree with my opinion on these issues – quite a lot of retired generals have expressed similar views.

On the other hand I object to the idea that soldiers any more of an idea of the situation than anybody else, as a few commenters have argued. Soldiers have a clear selection bias as young people who join the army have preconceived ideas about the war and its justifications. Those who object to it will hardly join the forces. Once joined and risking life and limb in a war that is or is not justified they are highly unlikely to change their opinion, as it would deprive them of more or less the only thing that makes their plight worthwhile – the idea that they are serving for a higher good. It is hard to live with a suspicion that you may have to die, just because some moron wanted to impress his daddy.

Why do you automatically think that your perspective is better then the soliders? serious question, looking for an explanation, not an attack.

I do think so. I do think rights can be abused. Free speech has been one of them. Protesting at a soliders funeral like the WBC does. I think they have no right to do that, to me it is just as bad as hate speech. Also, the person, calling (this is not the current adminstraiotn but in general) the USA a horrible nation of killers and evils, and you live in that nation, I feel that is abusive since their are a lot of countriess where if you talk down about it you will be straight up killed for it. Kim jong ill, Chair mao, and a host of others will just up right kill you. you have ALLL the right to say what you want about the current adminstration, but it´s been said 1000 times, and we all know he´s not coming back. So while staying critical is good, consistent mockery only has ended up dividing more.

Thanks for saying serious question, that made my day, you probably will but just for sure I want this to be a debate, not a mud slinging contest, I´m 100% sure you agree.

You’re an idiot.

Because I’ve had at least half a dozen E-mails suggesting that Obama is a Muslim (despite the fact that he’s not) and I’ve seen repeated racist jibes at his wife (such as calling her his “baby mama” despite the fact that his children were born in wedlock) from the right wingers such as Fox News.

What!?

What I got out of the picture was that it was actually a stab at the right. I thought it was trying to make a point of showing the underhanded tactics some (not all, I refuse to generalize) conservatives have used in painting Obama as a terrorist for their own political gain. I guess the Obama campaign didn’t feel the same way though.

Whatever the intent of the satire though, I don’t think the New Yorker should apologize. Controversial political satire has been a mainstay of this country’s history since it’s inception. Like it or not the things illustrated in that picture have been major issues in the campaign thus far and because I value free speech (I am a liberal after all) I feel the New Yorker had a right to print it.

… I’d like to know who keeps sending her e-mail asking to see the twins, wtf.

That’s why it’s so funny watching the leftists complaining about it.