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Senators, truthfully we would just like you to know that we are going to sit here today and act contrite, but when we leave we’re going to go back to our mansions, yachts, and ranches and laugh our asses off.
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No words can describe my annoyance with both ends of this argument.
The whole situation is fubar’d. As usual, the taxpayers get the shaft, without even the courtesy of a reach-around.
Full Metal Jacket reference for the win? *has hand up for high five*
*high fives*
*has the mentally challenged Peter Griffin laugh afterward*
Sweeeet.
Aw-right!
I’m going to microwave a bagel and have sex with it…
Let it cool for two minutes this time…
*secret announcer voice*
The correct answer was… “Butter’s in the fridge!”
Thanks for playing and better luck next time on What is that Reference!
That’s our Quagmire!
What two ends of which argument? I feel I’ve missed something again. (And no, not the financial crisis. ;p)
It’s almost too true to be funny. I still laughed, though.
I am hoping the future wars LOL in the upcoming makes front page. I actually got a chuckle from it. And I love that picture…
This got a depressed snicker from me though.
Yes, I feel the same. If 90% of their assets disappeared, they would still be wealthy.
and if 90% of their asses disappeared, they’d still be fat…
TOO SOOOOOOOON!!!!!
Hey, this isn’t fair. Don’t you remember that time that a student made a mistake on their loan and the bank decided to just cut them some slack? Oh, right, neither do I
*looks at payment made to keep those damn people from calling me for the next month or so*
…
TOO SOON!!!!1111!!1!
We should start calling their offices. “Hi, this is John, from Nevada. Currently you are running a debt of around 10 grand (whatever it is per person for the bank) and you’ve been missing your payments for a few months. The repo men come tomorrow. With machetes”
If only…..
Now that is a collection department I could get behind. They keep wanting people to take collection jobs here and I haven’t quite developed the taste for human vitae yet.
I’m very …..”skilled” when it comes to collections. Being a 300lb guy with an alarming smile helps…
My wife works at a small installment loan company. In these tough times, her office could use someone with your skills. YOU’RE HIRED!!!
We all know you’re really Penn Jillette.
I wish!
Ken Lewis…CEO of Bank of America
Of course, the Senators are going to go back to THEIR mansions, yachts, and ranches, and laugh their asses off, too.
Bribery buys bailouts.
and bailout money paid for the bribes… it’s a vicious cycle…
It’s not like any of that is a surprise…
Of course not. Let’s face it, you could see someone running up to kick you in the goods from across the room, thus not being a surprise. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s gonna hurt like hell once they do. LOL
What’s worse is when the convince you the kick in the nuts is only going to help you out in the long run…
…and come back a little while later wanting to kick you in the nuts again.
like a bike with no seat?
Because god forbid you actually acknowledge our right to accumulate money in a free society. I mean, we could stop doing the banking, offering loan products and deciding who’s likely enough to pay it back that we make money and people get the temporary capital they need to try to improve. We could take cushy union jobs where we sit around getting $45 an hour and actually earning $0.45, collecting big tax refunds from our president since we’d make less than $250,000. Or we could be unemployed and get to take money from medicaire and social security instead of paying into it. So yes, instead we’ll take as much as we can of what we EARNED, and enjoy it until you come tax it away from us, at which point we’ll all laugh as the country descends into hell.
Somebody sticks up for the little guys, the bankers so unrepresented in our democracy. I don’t mind them being rich (too much) but I do mind being the one put on the financial chopping block for their (Senators and bankers alike) screwups.
Testify
what I mind is the doublecross that our elected officials pulled on us.
“(Senators and bankers alike) screwups” of the moral variety
The clue is in the description ‘elected officials’… and they started pulling this in November last year… it would have happened no matter the colour of govt, despite what the Reps in senate care to pretend…
No one represents the banks, eh? Ever heard of a lobbyist? They’re far more powerful than any defender of consumers will ever be.
So, you approve of banks screwing each other until they don’t know who they can trust?
I see
you’re a cretin.
I’ve been over this too many times. Capitalism is right, but you’re too stupid and/or thieving to figure it out, so don’t talk to me.
Pure capitalism with no controls? Honest question.
With no *government* controls beyond the enforcement of contracts and the criminal laws against force and fraud. If we want to set up a Better Banking Business Bureau and refuse to do business with any bank that doesn’t agree to let the bureau determine whether or not the executives get bonuses, we’re free to do so. And then the banks can decide what to do.
There is such a stupid oversupply of labor that it would be a return to exploitative labor conditions (your argument with DWN below), the children would simply starve or work those hours. There is an argument for “but they’d just start their own business,” but that takes way too much capital in our high-tech society. I see your point, but think it would bring less of the free market you think, and more hell on earth. As it progressed and monopolies formed, it would just get worse. What we have is screwed up, but I prefer it to pure capitalism.
edit: by which I mean “no *government* controls beyond the enforcement of contracts and the criminal laws against force and fraud.”
But individuals are possessed of so much more capital today. Many of the high-tech industries you talk about can be conducted through non-personal communication with phones and computers. Would children starve? No, they’d just open up a market for food that’s far cheaper, and that’s an opportunity. Or it would convince the parents to do more work to feed the kids.
Oh, and for better arguments that I can articulate, watch the 10-hour series Free to Choose by Milton Friedman. It’s free to watch.
http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc1/NegativeIncomeTax.html
He doesn’t say what you’re thinking he does. I agree with some of his stuff, but I don’t think either of us agrees with him
In a 10 hour piece of performance art, there’s bound to be something everyone agrees with, and enough vague comment to qualify as a Barnum statement.
or put the kids to work. You really didn’t study history did you? An unregulated market can band together and set whatever prices it wants and make their customers into serfs because they are the Only market.
Another shop opens up only to be offered the With Us or Against Us option and either dies or sells out, meaning there is no new market. I suggest looking up Trust Busting in the history books.
Trust busting: government interference in a free market. Ruined the great economy of the second half of the 19th century.
The point went into an entirely different direction since you don’t have human emotions.
Thank you for the compliment.
Clinical sociopath
I don’t think steroid is a sociopath. I just think he’s an asshole.
The general effect is the same.
Fester, frickin’ love you here and on graph jam. One day, we’ll be up partying with Odin and stuff.
The religion debate graphs I’ve read from there look like “Fundies s. Fester!” arguments.
It’s what Unc charmingly refers to as his ‘roid rage. I mean, come one DWN, how dare the government interfere in the great economy of the second half of the 19th century that was built on child and immigrant labor with working conditions that would make an unwanted 5 year old Chinese girl cringe.
It’s why everything is being offshored… these damn child labour laws…
The sad thing is he thinks he would be ahead without these laws instead of just another serf…
Without child labour laws, his job would have been done by a slightly dull 8 year old…
Kill the Prime Minister of Malaysia!
-
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Obey my dog!
What is this, a center for ants!? This will have to be……..three times this big!
One of my favorite movies EVAR
Explains. Everything.
I like a lot of non-mainstream movies. It explains nothing other than I have a wide variety of likes. I have a pretty narrow variety of dislikes, but I saved a special place in there for you.
Why? Can you explain one thing I did to personally attack you?
You’re acting like a child. Not surprising.
And Zoolander is not mainstream? You’re joking, right?
A Ben Stiller movie is not mainstream…lol!
I’ve linked a personal attack you made on me last night, one of several. Next, please.
“Therefore, rules have to be set in place to protect the most people the greatest amount of the time.”
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Are you going to suggest your statement wasn’t racist, sexist or bigoted
ooops.
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in the least? Because where I am from, that’s disenfranchisement, baby!
How are you going to possibly suggest that it is? Also, nice strawman. You’ve managed to try to change the subject, yet again. Want to answer the charge that you’ve made no attacks on me, when I’ve linked a clear-cut personal attack that was completely unwarranted?
Where did I say YOU were? Hmmm?
You made a statement, I countered with, and I quote:
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The most people the greatest amount…
Racist. Sexist. Bigot.
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The only thing I said about YOU is “you might be a redneck.”
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Do you know what strawman means, Patty?
“You’re assuming (again) that you can get all of the people to agree with you all of the time. That’s just not possible. Therefore, rules have to be set in place to protect the most people the greatest amount of the time.”
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If we all agreed with this we’d still have slavery and you couldn’t vote, hon.
The difference between many others and me is that I’m not going to make some ridiculous juvenile statement about how I’ve bested you.
I think you didn’t mean this choice of words in this context.
Learning experience for all.
I’m not sure where you’re getting that you’ve ‘bested’ me. You never answered my questions, and you’ve refused to defend your strawman. On top of that, you scatter post and stalk, all while making crazy claims and calling people vulgar, stupid names.
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I don’t feel the need to feed you any longer, so if that gives you the thrill of thinking that you’ve bested me, you just go right on ahead.
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And quit being so literal.
Seriously? Look in a mirror! Everything you say is exactly what you do!
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Can’t even be magnanimous enough to admit when you’re wrong…what a shame.
Strawman= A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent’s position.
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I’m addressing your exclusionary words straight on. It’s either how you meant them, or you meant something else and should explain what your actual meaning was. You’re the one bringing a strawman into it, hon.
LOL!
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Hello (echoes)…
First assumption: parents. Not necessarily going to stick around. Individuals are possessed of more capital today. The cost to compete is also higher. Agriculture is impenetrable next to megafarms. The “cheaper market for food.” Who would open it up? Assuming competition to Joe’s Megafarm opens up, Joe’s can just lower their prices temporarily until the opponent is out of business, then raise them again. Those opening the business would be risking their livelihood (with no safety net under your system), the competition just won’t happen. Add in some anti-monopoly laws and I think you’re on the right track, but the barriers to entry are simply too high for reasonable competition (in my opinion, though I think history bears me out). Labor is simply in too great a supply for the workers not to end up working for bread and a (tiny) roof, if that. This is getting into tl;dr territory, I’ll see what you’ve got about that
So open a new competitor every day and the megafarm has to keep its prices low permanently.
And just where are you getting the capital to do this? You can’t just poop a new business every day. Or, if you can, I think that the time you are spending on the internet posting here would be better spent pooping out new businesses.
wow, I always post the exact same argument as somebody else. I need to start reading the frickin posts. No spam intended
But you’d be fighting a war of attrition. If you have enough compatriots to pull it off, you beat the big company. If you don’t, you didn’t deserve to win. If on the other hand you bring in government thugs, then you’re nothing but a thief.
So if I put in a competitor to Walmart, and I don’t win, I should just kill myself?
Judge for yourself. Can you beat them? If not, and you don’t want to risk the capital, let walmart thrive.
So what you’re saying is that there need to be groups, let’s call them “unions,” in order to pull it off? The fact remains that it takes an absurd amount of people to challenge a company as large as ConAgra foods. You have to have people sell equipment to them, you need farmers, transport, and a willing distributor. Here we get to a disagreement that neither will budge on, I think. I think the barriers to knocking down the large companies are too high, you evidently don’t. I think history still bears me out (Gilded Age), you need anti collusion laws, anti trust laws, neoliberalism (like all other ideologies) has limits
Unions are fine, so long as they don’t call in the government via the law and have them stack the deck in the union’s favor.
Then Wal-Mart would gain stupid amounts of power, to answer your first bit, and end up worse than any government could dream up. Wal-Mart Cartel would BE the government, the supplier of food, power, and education, and would act only in its own interest. I think we’ve hit the level of Irreducible Complexity. You believe (correct me if wrong) that given time a few monopolies will form, and that is a good thing. I believe that a few (or one) monopoly(ies) in existence would be a bad thing. I can’t even imagine why the monopolies would be a good thing, they seem pseudo-fascist at best, but agree to disagree?
The difference is that instead of voting out this pseudogovernment every 2-4 years, and getting nothing and no receipts for our financial contributions, we could withhold our payments any day and change the policies.
You’re living in a dream world to think that COULD happen. It would take massive mobilization of the public, and for all of them to be on the same page. As we saw in our last presidential election, we can only get (at best) 51% of the people to agree part of the time. You’d have complete anarchy, and no government structure to speak of. You might as well use the Constitution as toilet paper while you’re at it.
Again, the real government would bind Walmart to its contracts just as it would the public. I’m really not an anarchist. But I do want to see the most able thrive honestly.
But that’s not what you’re advocating. You’re acting as though everyone will act in everyone else’s best interests and let the ‘good’ companies thrive whiel the bad ones go under. That’s not the way it works in the real world. On paper, sure. But everything works on paper.
“The difference is that instead of voting out this pseudogovernment every 2-4 years, and getting nothing and no receipts for our financial contributions, we could withhold our payments any day and change the policies.”
Still too much inertia. It takes an uprising on the same scale it would take to overthrow our government to overthrow the pseudogovernment. Again, we can all point fingers at each other, I think we probably are at that IC point of debate. Steroid thinks that the people could deal with a bad company that gained momentum. I don’t, some others don’t. Does that sound like a fair assessment?
Froufrou: The whole point is to follow the paper the same way we’re supposed to with the Constitution.
Jonathan: Yes, I think it would be easier to deal with a bad company than a bad government.
You’re assuming (again) that you can get all of the people to agree with you all of the time. That’s just not possible. Therefore, rules have to be set in place to protect the most people the greatest amount of the time.
The most people the greatest amount…
Racist. Sexist. Bigot.
Hi Anniee. Still mad that I don’t agree with you arbitrarily?
What you are describing as “Walmart Cartel” used to exist in the USA for many large companies–they had the company store, which set prices for the workers to by their food and clothes from, they had their own company police, and they owned the small houses that the workers lived in–and rented from the company. And this was the big mines, the large steel industries, etc. We are all too young (I think?) to remember the huge violent battles that occurred when workers tried to unionize in the 1910′s and 1920′s–the workers were often killed by those company police, supported by the local police (who were financed by the companies).
Admittedly, there was also bombing going on courtesy of anarchists at the time (Wall Street’s first bombing). But anarchists were used as an excuse to fire weapons at unarmed protesters.
This information provided to you courtesy of a child of older parents0-who were born of older parents.
There I disagree, and I don’t think either of us can prove the other wrong. Our government naturally rotates out, and has easy mechanisms for change, but if you disagree with that assessment and think the other way would be easier, neither of us has good enough evidence to change my mind, don’t know about yours, making this the point where we agree to disagree or engage in the internet tradition of calling each other names when we don’t have point, and I don’t really feel like name-calling.
Hi Patty.
Racist. Sexist. Bigot.
Maybe you are a redneck!
I’m assuming that the incentive of force is best wielded by the good against the bad, the lazy, the thieves.
Aw, are you ginning up for some real name-calling now? Fire away, Chuckles.
Patty… what is this obsession with patty?
I pointed out you made up a lesbian daughter…
Indeed. That’s why you invented her…
Viking gal: the song “Sixteen Tons” is all about the company store and lousy working conditiions. The pop culture of the time is still available if you look. Steinbeck, Upton Sinclair, John dos Passos, all their works are still in print.
Steroid, you’re making the same incorrect assumptions about human nature that Friedman, Marx and Bakunin made: that people will ultimately act for the greater good. Except in rare cases, people keep their own interests first. Workers won’t spontaneously show up at a factory to make widgets (cf Bakunin) unless you pay them. If you don’t pay them enough, they’ll leave, or else organize and force you to pay higher wages. As the current crisis shows, bankers given an opportunity to make money by selling off loans aren’t going to care about the quality of the loans they make.
Those who gain power, whether economic or political, will work to preserve and expand their own power regardless of the consequences to the greater society. Put simply, you can’t trust powerful people to govern themselves. This has been proven over and over. There’s a great line from an old Doctor Who episode: “Give an ape control of its environment and it will fill the world with bananas.” We’ve let the apes at AIG, Bank of America, Goldman Sachs et al get all the bananas they wanted, at our expense. Now we’re left with a giant pile of peels and monkey shit.
Deregulation of the financial market just doesn’t work. We all know what happened in 1929; prior to that the situation was exactly as you described (government enforces contracts only.) We see how well that worked. The savings and loan industry was deregulated in 1981. By 1989, the S&Ls had overleveraged themselves and gone belly up. In 1999, mortgage lending was deregulated. By 2008, the housing market had collapsed, and all the side bets (credit default swaps) had to be covered. And here we are now. How many times does the million-pound monkeyshit hammer have to come down before you understand that Friedman and the rest of the Chicago School just didn’t get it?
*golf clap*
Spot-on, guvnah!
@Ignatz: Great post! I was humming “16 Tons”
while reading Viking Gal’s post. GMTA?
Another neat book: How the Other Half Lives
by Jacob Riis. It dates back to the turn of
the last century. Riis was a photojournalist, iirc,
so the photo plates are terrific.
I cite that book a lot to people who whine about welfare queens. Riis, Upton Sinclair, Steinbeck, dos Passos, all worth reading.
Ignatz: If people are so corrupt, why are governments any better than corporations? Governments comprise people too, don’t they?
Governments contain mechanisms that limit their activities(checks and balances) and that allow for change (elections). Corporations are only limited by laws, imposed by governments.
Governments exist to enforce a social contract between the citizenry and the various branches of the government. Corporations exist to generate profit by providing some good or service, usually at the lowest possible cost to the corporation and the highest possible cost to the consumer.
Governments are ultimately answerable to the citizenry. Corporations are only answerable to their shareholders.
A corrupt person in authority in government can be removed through government action or through popular action. A corrupt person in authority in a corporation is usually generating profit for the corporation, and is maintained.
You can’t vote out the CEO of Bear Stearns without being a shareholder, but you can vote out your congresscritter.
Well, we could set up government programs or tax breaks to help individuals poop out their businesses…oh wait, that’s government interference, nevermind.
the risk is too great for the opener, that capital is simply swallowed up by the megafarm. Neoliberal theory has its good points, but following it absolutely leads to monopoly.
Generally speaking, any economic system, allowed to run unregulated ends in a monopoly or a cartel.
Which individuals are in possession of what capital?
I think this point doesn’t work in an economy where people are living paycheck to paycheck.
Wow, that’s funny. I’m an individual without much capital today. I guess I slipped through the cracks somehow.
“Would children starve? No, they’d just open up a market for food that’s far cheaper, and that’s an opportunity.”
`
A modest proposal?
And monopoly/cartel works just fine in your world…
to quote Bill Gates (via Robin Williams) “Monopoly is just a board game.. I’m tryng to rule the world!”
Only if I get Kentucky/Indiana/Illinois. Far more productive than the Boardwalk/Park Place monopoly actually.
i always did well with the light blue/ yellow corner by the jail. also with green/orange
Erm. Elkhart County (where I live) has one of the highest unemployment rates in the country. It’s in Indiana. We’re not being real productive of late.
Trade your houses in for hotels!
Well don’t worry, the Thimble is coming around Free Parking and should be hitting you guys any time now. We can make this profitable yet!
How come I never get to be the thimble, huh?
Stupid thimble people! They always make me be
the wheelbarrow, just because I like gardening…
my parents always bought “pre-played” board games.. I usually ended up being the slightly chewed-on lego.
*I* have the new Monopoly complete with the money bag piece. I like to be the money bag. But the race car is still awesome, yo.
I always used the Scotty dog, because he was cute.
I always liked the horse, myself. Oh, and I still have my Monopoly set from when I was a kid! The box is pretty much completely disintegrated, but the game itself is just fine.
You know where there are no controls on banking, and labor has no say? Iraq! Afghanistan! The Darfur! (Hell, all of Africa!)
Things are going great there, don’t you think?
Uh oh…looks like the roid rage is kicking in.
So back to child labor and to hell with the 40 hour work week and you’ll be damned if anybody deserves overtime…
Back to freedom of choice. No one put a gun to the children’s heads and told them to work. No one barred the door against leaving at the end of an 8-hour shift. You took your choice and you took the consequences. You think the workers aren’t getting enough? Start a competing business, offer the workers more, draw all the best talent and outperform the old firm until they either move their policies in line with yours or go out of business. But if you’re wrong, it’s you who’ll be bankrupt. Right choices rewarded, wrong choices fail. What’s unfair about that?
You don’t work, do you… never have…
I’m not the one posting at all hours.
‘Not working now’ =/= ‘never worked’. Fester is retired. He’s saying that ou’ve never had the pleasure of drawing a wage in honest work, which I’m imclined to agree with.
What constitutes honest?
nothing you or I have been acquainted with. I had a way with pain, you seem to like slavery and call it ‘freedom’. Out of the two of us, I have the cleaner hands.
Says you. My work is as honest as the day is long. I have no trouble believing that you haven’t done honest work though.
Yeah, but, based on your other drivel, you
wouldn’t have much trouble believing in the
tooth fairy, now would you?
Measured mid-December, in Murmansk.
It’s called retirement, meaning he worked his time and it is done.
As for your answer, that would have technically been the choice back when there was child labor. They worked because they had to support their families because monopolies and cartels made it so.
Stating that if I don’t like the mountain to be climbed that I can just make another mountain is naive at best. I am finding myself agreeing more and more with the assessment that things were handed to you instead of you working for them.
And I am posting from work in times where there is a lull, thus I haven’t posted as much as I would have liked today since Monday is hell until about 6pm central.
I decided, did I want more money, or did I want a life… I chose to have a lif, while I’m still rich enough and healthy enough to enjoy it….
I enjoy prodding cretins…
somehow, your god awful shifts don’t really cut it.
Having said that, if I get the right call, I’ll pack my bag, kiss my wife goodbye, and have one more Night at the Opera…
Why does that conjure up images in my head of you carrying a suspicious looking hard carrying case that’s about 18″ by 3′ long, and you trying to get rhough customs at some border town by flashing a well-made fake badge?
If I was going through any kind of border control, I’d be inept.
My dad always had government papers that said, no, airline employee, you are not allowed to check what is in that brown wrapped cylinder shaped package
Ya, I know people that work at General Mills over here and talk about how great the money is and then how they have two days off every three weeks. And mandatory overtime with maybe being able to see the sun in a couple years. I wish I was making this up because I would love to make 600 dollars for a 12 day of overtime…
All I can think is that I have kids and they need a father… So I go for a less paying job so I can be a dad. That is more important to me.
*12 hour day
Priorities. you need to have them. Time is a harsh mistress. She’ll ride you like a wh0re and then drop the shell along the way if you’ll let her.
A wise man chooses his moments. A greedy man gets what he’s given
I think you misread, I am not working the zombie job. I chose my kids which are my priority. Though you might be trying to go for a different point than I was assuming.
i work 80 hours per week across 3 jobs. In my “off” time, I run my 2 businesses, one being my comedy career, and the other being a talent management company. All in all, I spend about 110 hours a week “working”. After all of that, I still end up having to borrow money to eat, because the money just doesn’t stretch where it needs to. I think I have a right to be upset when these fat cat bankers and politicians, who’ve never seen a day of REAL work in their life start whining because they can’t have ther 6 figure bonuses. Tough. Live with it. If you live beyond your means, that’s your own damn fault. You are an exec in the Banking Industry, you should have had better financial planning. If you can’t manage your own money, I sure as hell don’t want you managing mine. When I talk to my wife through email and text more than I do face to face, because I’m stuck at work all the time, and I’m willing to put in the hard hours, willing to break my back to put food on my table, you have no place to complain about not being able to pay your country club dues and have the house boy throw an extra coat of wax on the boat. I’ll gladly do your job, for 50% of your annual salary, and be dang happy for the money I’m making.
No, I simply agreed with you in a clumsy way… I echoed all your sentiments.
You’ve chosen wisely…
Kinky, parka time!
I’m sorry, I keep re-reading your paragraph that says “No one put a gun to the children’s heads and told them to work. No one barred the door against leaving at the end of an 8-hour shift.” I can’t even mock this properly, it’s just too incredibly ignorant I’m overwhelmed!
You have to understand, Steroid has apparently been given everything he’s ever obtained in life, and has probably never really worked. He doesn’t understand the way the real world functions, and was probably doodling on his notepad during history class. He’s obviously never heard of child labor, then and now. He’s never seen or heard about the abject poverty that existed ‘back in the day’ that required you to work 20 hour days in order to get 15 cents to try to feed your family. I hope that one day he grows up and learns this stuff, but for right now, it’s best to stay away from him so that the stupid doesn’t rub off and infect you.
to coin one of my favourite words – steroid is a neotenous loon.
It’s like people who say there is ‘no such thing as ‘enough’ money. The really have no idea of their mortality. NOBODY ever said that they wished they’d spent more hours at the office… unless their life was so accursed as to stand out as unfortunate in a plot by Euripides…
Possibly banging your secretary because your wife is some creature from another world who was delightful at first but her desire to consume human organs became too much to stick around for.
Those are your values. Mine involve money. The difference is that I don’t come to your house every April 15 and take 20% of your family or time or whatever it is you do with your life.
They can’t tax time…
and you are a slave of mammon. Sad. Empty. Babbling. You’ll die at best alone, and worst despised.
But richer, which is what really matters. I don’t care if you despise me, only if you steal my money, which you do.
Says you. You don’t know me. I get happiness from money.
Already established that you don’t think on a rational scale of human emotion so moving on. Oddly enough I did read about a group of people who can’t form social bonds with other people but instead form them with objects, even believing they have souls, complete with sexual attraction.
So since you are beyond serious conversation on the matter, I am curious what bonds you have with this money you love so much.
Buys hookers.
Because I’m beyond human. I am a soul independent, unfettered by ties to the past. I define my values and fulfill them.
And I buy hookers.
LOL!
Riiight…. you’re a sociopath.
Jeffrey Dhamer
Ted Bundy
Dennis Rader
Gary Ridgway
“Although I have cast conventional morality aside,
I can say
I have LIVED”
you sad, babbling, empty, moron.
I am a sociopath with a rigid moral code.
You’re just silly…
I’d not worry… although there are people like that, this one is no more ‘real’ than I am…
*sigh* Well fine then. I’m just saying it was a good punishment. Those Greeks knew what they were about.
Look up Scaphism, it’s a hoot.
Nah, I think this twit is just full of it. Although I believe the hookers part.
You’re also not building roads, paying for cops, or doing any of the other things that make my life easier either.
-
Now, if you want to take my daughter off my hands for 20% of the time so I could finally get a decent nights sleep, come on with you.
But I don’t want to make your life easier. I want to make my life easier. I care more about myself than you.
Then you need to move away and form your own country. Here in America, we tend to try to help one another. Even the crazy Conservative side of my brain is pinging that you’re nuts.
I thought America was ‘if you’re poor, you die in the street’….
No no no, that’s only in Lubbock.
TESTIFY!
No, you all need to move away and leave the freedom-lovers here.
…or Houston.
You only care about yourself.
For yourself, you only care about money.
If you seriously believe any of what you’re saying, then you need to lock yourself in a sealed room with all your money and starve to death. Please do it now.
I only care about myself. Why is that wrong?
Hey, froo: Watch it about Houston.
Let’s compromise and trash Amarillo, okay?
I can totally do that
Can we trash Lufkin too?
Amarillo – Kill a punk and get probation.
It’s my favourite third world city!
@steroid. If you truly only care about yourself, you are a sorry person. You are missing absolutely everything of value in life. I am hoping that you don’t have any weapons, and please, do not breed.
They won’t breed… they only get to use hookers…
Now fessie, we all know your mom bred, even though she had the syph.
Mother still turns tricks with Lascar sailors… so, what’s your point?
Not even the syph could force her to waste the money to abort you.
Quality mothering, right there.
Well, your mother obviously thought you were worth the trouble. More’s the pity for her that she was so very, very wrong.
Thing is, when they try to insult your mother, you know you’ve out classed them.
One thing about my mother, in even an unfair fight, she could take them…
Wow. I’m cryin’ inside.
Did you think that one up all by your widdle lonesome?
QED
oh, and PWNED!
*Neslon Muntz laugh and point*
lol
Inner child looking for a spank-nanny, much!?
You’re apparently laboring under the apprehension that taxation is theft. Taxation is payment for services rendered by the government. If you use the services of police, fire department, road maintenance, clean air and water, pure food and medicines, a court system, in short any service provided by local, state or federal government, then you are expected to pay for them. If you don’t like the services or don’t like paying for them, you’re free to revoke your end of the social contract and take your patronage to another country. If you live here and call yourself a citizen, then you keep up your end as a citizen.
Ya, it was hard to post to. I do have a headache.
Provide me with one example of a company in a free economy that actually forced someone to work.
Now… that’s a loaded question.
The question is ‘I want to find someone who wants to be sued by a current/previous employer…’
you’re just scum.
As in had thugs beat them. Check what happened with animator strikes for Disney back in the day. Also, when you own the market, you can set your wages to whatever you want and eventually families will crack and have to send children to work to have enough providers to buy even the cheapest food.
History, read it. It covers all of this.
Pissing. In. The. Wind.
Steroid is an idiot.
But I couldn’t hold it…
time for the rectal probe?
If I say no, will it not happen?
Unless you reckon on not getting over 45, I have some very bad news…
Damn, damn, damn…
Sorry. Be prepared for the ‘rubbery snap’
Whine, whine, whine.
Try an annual GYN exam, every year, starting at puberty!
Or a monthly (until the last two months, then it’s weekly) GYN exam when you get pregnant!
Yeesh! I’ve heard about those!!
Oooh, they suck so bad! I hate them. Hopefully, after this one, that will be the last time I have to go more than once a year
You try a long needle up the ass to take samples…
No thanks, I’m trying to quit.
link
At least I append arguments to my insults, you subhuman leech.
Your arguments make no sense. So how are they helping again?
They make sense on the axioms that my life and my property are my own.
You’re doing this as a social experiment, aren’t you? You can’t possibly believe the crap that’s falling out of your mouth, right?
Should I ask the same about you?
He believes we don’t just rent stuff? LOL
Never seen the light die in someone’s eyes, nor heard their last breath….
Seen title and disposal after the death. The beauty and the glory of the monetary system.
And yet, the guy who died, OWNED the property, didn’t get to take it with him. Hmmmmmm, that implies rental as opposed to own.
He enjoyed it and disposed of it at will. What more is needed for ownership?
Cretin…
Thief.
liar.
Buggerer.
Unreasonable.
(Not you, testify, you’re doing a good job)
Random bile-spewage is a good job? I see your motivation now.
He (or she) is making me laugh.
*imagines steriod giggling maniacally at a burst sewer pipe*
No, but I am laughing at the fact that you’re literally like the 10th person to spell my name wrong.
*imagines Saint taking it up the pooper and begging for more*
you have strange fantasies…
I know! Isn’t it great!
Actually, you don’t wage slave, you make noises to justify your greed and emptiness…
Yes, I’m greedy because greed is the path of righteousness for me. And I am the only justification I need. I am the alpha and the omega.
Ah, meglomania. Talking to you is like pissing into the wind since you have no concept of right and wrong, only want and don’t want. Your justification won’t matter in the end and mostly doesn’t matter now. The sad thing is that you can’t be reasoned with and thus all attempts at communicating are doomed to failure because you can’t comprehend anything but your own law.
Sadly, you are the second person I have met online who thinks like this.
I can be reasoned with. I just need someone willing to accept some other axiom besides “we all belong to each other.”
As a dyed-in-the-wool Capitalist, I can say this with all honesty: reasoning with you is about as necessary and worthwhile as trying to teach a fish how to knit sweaters. You’re just going to get wet, waste your time, and probably piss off the fish. So I leave you to your swimming. Try not to drown.
^^^^ Stockholm syndrome.
Froufrou: how capitalistic are you if you don’t like capitalism?
Why the hell would anyone care to reason with that sort?
It’s beyond any redemption…
Implying that I need to be redeemed which assumes your conclusion. No wonder you don’t want to reason with me: you suck at it!
I love capitalism. But pure, unregulated ANYTHING is a bad idea, and that’s what you’re advocating. Pure capitalism, in it’s true form, is subject to the human factor, just like socialism, communism, or any other -ism you want to name. In their pure forms they are beautiful things that work and help the people using them. In their actual forms in the real world, they damage the very people they are supposed to help. You HAVE to have some type of SOMETHING in there to protect people from themselves. Now, my liberal friends in here would call that needing the government to control it completely. I disagree. I think there needs to be a few laws here and there to keep the stupid from hurting themselves and others, but overall just let it be. However, you can’t expect Mom and Pop down the street to be able to compete with a megaconglomerate like Walmart on merit alone. It just doesn’t work that way. I’m sorry.
I thought you were planning to STFU?
*that there need to be a few laws in place.
-
Geez, I’d give my English Teacher Mother a fit right now!
So basically you can be reasoned with if they agree with you. That isn’t reasoning with you, that is just agreeing with you. However, I already stated why this can’t work.
I just said I was going to let Steroid splash around in the wading pool. Worry to disappoint you, whoever you are this week.
See, to me that’s the problem. A failure to align with purity is a failure in the person, not the purity. Purity is an end in itself for me. I’d rather meet physical ruin while maintaining philosophical perfection than to achieve great deeds on sullied ideas. I don’t insist everyone agree; I do insist they let me do as I believe right.
DWN: I can be reasoned with if I can be understood. I don’t need you to agree with my values. I need you to get them and understand why they are right for me.
You may believe that killing a small child for the thrill of it is right. I cannot agree with that, and cannot let it happen. Therefore, I put laws in place that prevent you from killing small children, which you see as right.
-
Do you see how that works? People are not perfect, therefore you can’t set up a system that operates on the assumption that people are going to use it in a perfect manner.
I don’t believe in killing small children. I do believe that not saving a small child from starvation is an entirely different concept.
If you don’t nned to be agreed with, the why espouse?
You need to be ‘admired’ when really, even the nuts here can only pity you.
You’re empty, sad and pointless. There’s nothingg to reason with, since you’re insane.
For my own edification, and to defend my property rights.
A small child dies because you could have helped and didn’t? That makes you worse than any mass murderer on the books, darling. The child is innocent, and has no choice.
-
Therefore, your way is not right FOR ME, nor is it right for the rest of thw rosd, thank goodness for laws that keep you from hurting yourself and others.
If no one cares for the child by choice, it has no right to claim care by force. And you can follow your own path, but stop doing it on my dime.
See, this is why I’m suggesting a move to a desert island, as America is set up to care for those who can’t care for themselves. If you’re honestly that dissatisfied with where you’re living or what you have to do to live there, why are you still here?
-
And you’re not a capitalist conservative, you’re an anarchist libertarian, which makes you dangerous to yourself and others. I suggest medication and possibly shock treatments.
You OWN stuff? Try taking it with you dirt ball. you RENT.
I am a libertarian, though not an anarchist, which makes me correct. And America was set up to be a place where the government secured the unalienable rights of the people, which don’t include care.
Steroid doesn’t understand the concept of rent, even when explained to him in terms of ‘renting a beer’.
Steroid is a cretin.
Steroid pays his bills on time, and that is what matters.
Does it? shame. I’d have come out of retirement for that bill default….
And you’d be waiting and starving, and I wouldn’t bail you out.
Why? So you could shake your fist and wheeze “get awf mah lawn!”
I own personal property if not real property.
LOL
you own nothing…
…and you just paid off your house, so it’s taken your whole life to officially own real property. Is that house perchance made of glass?
The strikers had government violence on their side. Disney had every right to defend themselves against hostility.
And capitalists didn’t invent hunger. If you can’t feed yourself, why in hell do you think you deserve to live?
So I guess if you lose both arms, or are paralyzed from the neck down and can’t support yourself, you don’t deserve to live. I’ll be sure to remember not to get hurt when I’m visiting your island where you are king.
Correct. Unless I use my brain and buy insurance.
SNAP!
Steroid is 12
Jealous?
Or horny?
Steroid is more than twice 12.
Then Steroid is neotenous
and Testify, it’s only your arse I’d ride raw…
Ah, I see. Steroid was handed his ‘wealth’ through inheritance, and has never been poor.
Steroid got a public school education and a college scholarship (academic) and has never been poor.
As did Testify. And a funded master’s program.
How cute is that that the two of you show up and leave together!
I’ve been here all day, where have YOU been?
Downright adorable. You think they hold hands on the bus?
Wait: didn’t you diss the hell out of me for posting this morning?
I think they hold each other’s ……er……well, not hands on the buss
Of course, considering that they’re the same person, that might get ‘them’ a public indecency charge.
Hmm. Yeah, come to think of it, that was this morning, but it was really more in reference to your posts of the evening/night before. Not really complaining about the lack of posting during the day; it’s more like that moment when it starts to get dark and the mosquitoes come out. (It’s not the posting I was objecting to, it’s the repeated multiple tiny content-free posts, over and over…)
Bus. BUS. Of course, if they’re kissing, buss works too. Just not in the context.
Fester does that constantly, but you don’t accuse him of meth use.
Just something to consider.
Fester is a CHARACTER, as you seem to have missed. Also, when not confronted by stupid *points to Testify as Exhibit ‘A’*, Fester is extremely well read, articulate, and a very nice guy. He answers stupid with contempt and the like, so you’re pretty much screwed for getting anything but a troll answer out of him.
He does it to you, too, so I guess that makes you screwed, too.
Are you screwed, Patty?
-
I love how you call me stupid, as it I care!
TESTIFY!
lol
Ah, the cry of the social Darwinist.
Greedy, empty, sad, and a slave to a puppet master who is not only demented but only remembers your last failure. I look forward to your death in the street.
At least I’m not a thief from the productive. I might die, but I’ll be right.
‘Right’… what a big word.
I’d say you were a parasite.
and who is the host?
humanity, you cur… you feed off the rest of the planet by screwing them dry…
Then tell my employer to lower my salary. They agreed to it; why shouldn’t I claim it?
They over pay you. You’re clearly talentless.
And yet they agreed, because I do my job well. Freedom is great, isn’t it?
How mature.
Like you’d know ‘mature’if it bit the arse you’d sell for cold cash…
You’d know about arse-peddling, having trolled the trainstations so much…
I cottaged the trainstation… trolling is what you do…
Who doesn’t? Gotta dangle a little bait if you wanna catch the big ones.
If you arrange for the starvation of others, how is that justified?
Because if they were able they’d feed themselves.
you’re silly.
But I can feed myself.
For now, under your system nothing guarantees your wage or food prices. You are dwelling within a system complaining and arguing for a system that won’t benefit you.
You aren’t the predator you think you are. Nobody is.
You’re right. I ask no guarantees. I can trade on the self-interest of the producer or get my own food.
Naa, you live in your mom’s basement and work like a slave.
You’re just laughable as you get more and more extreme
I live in a paid-up apartment and work in an office.
you RENT!
Ha!
Saddo!
Office! you like being a janitor?
*buzz* wrong, ooh, thank you for playing.
Feh! Like you’d admit it…
you’re just a failure. A talentless no-mark who watched ‘Wall Street’ one too many times and thinks they know everything, while making personal calls and using the company internet…
I’m a success and resident genius who pays for his own phone as well. (iPhone, really cool)
what ever you say…
I think you’re a failure, and I think you know you’re a failure…
See below re: falsifiable statements.
Which ones?
The ones where I made up shagging you for cash?
You said you paid hookers…
Yeah, but they’re expensive so not too often.
LOL
Not only sad, but cheap too… you’re a real catch
Only pensioners can afford top-quality tail.
You’d know sweet cheeks…
Not yet, but I hope to live that long with the wealth I’ve accumulated so I can find out.
Provide me with one example of a free economy. But I’m getting tired of this debate, people just have different values. I value human rights. You value wealth. So long as you don’t call the shots, I’m fine with a nonviolent sociopath
The issue with the non-violent sociopath is all it takes is
One.
Bad.
Day.
There are so many things wrong with this post that I don’t even know where to begin.
Are you really suggesting that an eight year old child made a choice to go to work of his/her own volition?
What child would do that? Only one TOLD to by his/her parents who either have no other options or are making babies to make money.
Are you really suggesting that an eight year old child made a choice to go to work of his/her own volition?
No. It’s just a fishing expedition. Considering the length of
the thread, I would say “steroid” is pleased.
Yeah, I posted that comment in reaction to the stupid suggestion THEN went and read — well, skimmed — the rest of the thread. I’m sorry he was fed so well; it means he’ll be back!
Someone get the kitty carrier ready and we’ll get that sucker off to the vet next time.
It did have to do a lot of work to keep the thread going, though. Eventually, that sort of troll (as opposed to the “hit-and-run” sort) gets tired of spurring things on. Hopefully, we will collectively ignore the troll and he will leave when the returns diminish.
Nah, plenty of billy goats gruff around here!
If the parents are responsible for the care of the child, they should also have the power to dispose of the child’s labor.
Um… you don’t need a gun. It’s a choice between working and starving to death. Step away from the Friedman, read Upton Sinclair and Jacob Riis, then we’ll talk.
As I said, business owners didn’t invent hunger. I’ve read Upton Sinclair, and I think it preys on emotion.
Three words. Triangle Shirtwaist Factory. Dress factory on the upper stories of a building. Management locked the doors to keep people from leaving during their breaks. When the place caught fire, the women working there had no choice but to jump from the windows. Some choice: burn to death or splatter on the pavement ten stories below.
Click my name and educate yourself.
Some choice: leave school and go to work at the age of 9, or starve to death.
Some choice: work a 14-hour shift, or lose your job for leaving early. Raise a fuss, and the company goons come and work you over. Then your name gets passed around to other employers who refuse to hire you. (You’ve heard of blacklisting, right?) These used to be common occurrences, until the government interfered.
When the wrong choices fail, they fail spectacularly, and people suffer. That’s the one thing Milton Friedman, the Chicago School, and most other neocons either don’t understand, or don’t care about.
It’s the ‘don’t care’. People are a self renewing resource, thus it’s always a buyer’s market. There are blips. Loom Weavers had a period where they could name their price…
TESTIFY!.
lol
I don’t care about it. If you choose wrong and fail, you deserve to fail spectacularly. Suffering is not a bad thing in and of itself. It’s only bad when good people suffer.
And how do you define “good people”?
My, the crickets are lovely tonight…
Since apparently Steroid isn’t interested in answering, I’m going out on a limb here and guess that Steroid’s definition of “good people” = Steroid and the rest of us can just eff off and die.
If it was pure capitalism, these guys would be OUT OF WORK now because of their extremely poor management choices, not getting bailed out by….us. Therein lies the problem with your analysis. I would have no problem with them making gazillions of dollars if they weren’t sucking at the public teat when they screw up and get too deep in the hole.
I agree with you sir. Too many though who say that are keen to move on to highly uncapitalistic positions.
Ma’am, actually.
Apologies.
Like you care.
See, I own up to my failings instead of robbing others to patch them.
Actually, you just rob and give to your self. The short comings you admit to cost nothing. You’re just a slave.
Rob whom? dissimilitude? You?
I don’t see you as being talented… who ever you’re employed by is over paying you…
This has GOT to be a social experiment. Even at my Neo-Con worst, I was never this psychotic.
Keep yapping, Patty. We all care so much what a traitor says.
Hi Anniee.
Hi Patty!
Seems you’re enjoying sucking off your friends in the Symbionese Liberation Army even after all these years.
I love the fact that you’re not even denying being Anniee anymore. I guess it’s shift change down at the local mental ward, and you slipped out of your room between two guards and found a computer?
Guess again, quisling!
who are you calling Patty, retard?
Look, we know your tag teaming youself with steroid, and that you’re not even the normal idiot who posts as Steroid…
We’ve indulged you, but now you’re just taking the piss…
You’re a bigger moron, and a bigger sociopath, than even the legendary Megabob of the 73 socks….
You need a life pal
LOL! Got a little jock itch there, fessie?
Dick getting crusty?
It’s only lacking your arse, hotstuff
Awww, he likes me! He REALLY likes me!
lol
And your worthless ass was forced to retire.
You just want me… in a sordid, sexual, way….
SO? You were still forced to retire. Which means you are the one currently dry humping the system!
Bwahahaha! Thanks for the tip, Test.
Talking to yourself now… that’s just creepy…
and if you need to think I was forced, then you live it up, wage slave.
I don’t need to try and support my own points by generating faux users….
Forced. To. Retire. Welfare Queen.
If you’re living on money that you yourself have saved, put back, and kept for when you do retire, you’re not a welfare queen. You’re smart. And, Testify, you’re stupid.
I’m stupid. That’s hilarious, Patty-taking-in-the-arse!
British retirement pension? Need a little help “getting” that?
BTW, you still owe me the $800+travel+accommodation+bodybag+boxcutter from our last session…
Someone do an IP trace to prove to this numbskull that I’m not Testify.
Did I say I was on a pension? I said I’d retired… who needs a pesnion yet?
You must have received my invoice, then!
LOL
So, you can use proxies sociopath… nice.
Typical retard…
You.
Owe.
Me.
Money.
Here you go, Fester [LINK]
Not getting enough pension, big boy?
Hey, you’re the one who reckons that everything is paid for…
You’re the one begging for more…
It’s so cool when your debate opponent offers an easily falsifiable statemnt so you can disprove it and laugh at him.
Designate the easily falsifiable statement…
you’re the one talking to yourself for company…
Why would I want to talk to myself when I’ve got such fine company in you, big boy!
You see, *I* know that I’m not Testify. (And so does Testify) You don’t, but that’s not my problem.
TESTIFY!
LOL!
Ah, but the thing is, it really does’t matter…
It looks like you’re Testify, and tbh, you may as well be the same person if you’re not… you’re just looking an arse, dear.
But, you ARE an arse. At least he just looks like one.
So, to you perception overrules truth. That explains a lot.
Ooooh, that stings. Damn, that must have taken you a week to come up with that insult. Please, hit again. I beg you.
Why, yes, Patty, you MAY have another.
-
Still need a pardon from BJ?
That wasn’t an insult, it was a point.
You’ve yet to make a point.
and this is the internet… looks like we’ve got one lonely sociopath protesting it’s two lonely sociopaths, it really doesn’t matter… the net effect is lonley socopath crowing how sociopathic they are… one, two… makes no real odds.
I think you think someone may be taking you seriously, when really, I’m taking the piss every chance, you’re taking te piss every chance, frou is taking the piss at every chance…
It’s a quadrille. None of this actually matters… it’s a fencing match with dulled foils and a masks…
If you really believe that crap, then god help the people around you. .
lol you love it and you fukcing KNOW it!
-
Suck it dry, skeksis-man!
was that English? It used the Roman alphabet, but that seemed to be the end of that…
Wow: At 5:52, Testify answered a question
posed to Steroid. What a coward!
With all the typos and misspells you make, you’re kidding, right?
-
*breaks glass to extinguish flaming straw man*
…and by coward, I mean “person who has to sock as two people to make up for a lack of security.
Is it me, or does anyone else smell Anniee?
First I’m Anniee, and now I’m Steroid.
-
Can you make up your minds who you are accusing me of being!
-
*hums “Paranoia”*
I’d say ‘stench’…
Note even close, but I’d be interested in meeting this person.
Steroid, too!
-
If you’d make up your mind as to who you are, it might make it easier on you. We, on the other hand, KNOW who you are. So we’re good.
And who would that be?
You are Anniee, pretending to be Steroid and Testify.
Did you and Mike not hit it off well?
LOL!
You guys need to get out more. Again, not even close.
Steroid, you’re amusing. I like you.
One of the charms of the internet sock… they tend to go for the argument from fallacy that they can be only one other person, when we have the Megabob who was over 70 different socks, many of which were engaged in long, pointless conversations about how great their points were.
Just take the fact that no one here actually takes you seriously anymore, no more than they do in your real life…
Did I ask anyone to take me seriously?
Nope! Not even once. Nor do I care if anyone does.
I’m amusing ME, and ultimately that is what matters to ME.
Am I trying to save anyone’s soul, or do I even care about said item?
NOPE!
@Testify and Steroid: I tried to spell out how
you got busted, but if you can’t understand
plain English, you are beyond help.
Actually, poking you was amusing to me… it was fun watching you dance to my tune while you thought I was dancing to yours…
Byee Anniee!!
Don’t forget to take your socks with you. Remember the time you left Mike under your mattress and he got all moldy…
HEE HEE! You guys and your paranoia, hilarity, I tell ya!
-
-
Needed one last laugh!
I Love the way they always feel the need to announce their deprature.
It’s like something from the 1960s Batman…
And then they reappear after their grand exit, and simply prove how pathetic they really are…
I actually was starting to wonder what happened to Anniee the Twit.. guess that puzzle has been solved. I wonder what the next appearance will be like? Hopefully we’ll get the one that is being repressed by evil Anniee. It’s almost like a bad remake of The Exorcist.
Wrong again, gents!
Nobody said I was making a grand exit, I just had to go, you know. do real life things.
Hence the TTFN.
Well…Testify, in this thread you were the only one to spell Anniiee’s name with two ii’s (which is the retarded spelling that she uses when she posts under that name).
-
How would you know that spelling unless you are indeed Anniiee? Hrmm.
Look up.
Yep, I spelled it wrong. Two iis and one e.
So? Relevance fail.
Sh!t, looks like I spelled it wrong twice, then.
LOL!
Wow….somebody got into their mommy’s meth stash last night, huh?
We really need a way to set preferences to “ignore” posts from people who start this crap.
LOL!
You’d be ignoring EVERYONE here, then, since from what I’ve seen, there is not a single person who HASN’T deliberately started some crap.
Isn’t that the point?
@diss:
I agree verily.
Again, same statement.
Tell me, would you ignore Fester, who you’ve all actually proclaimed is the biggest crap starter? Or would you continue to be entertained by his shenanigans?
Deep Thought, process…
@Testify:
Sorry – was your 8:15 am post aimed at me?
If you want, or whoever wants to answer it.
No biggie!
Aah. In that case, meh.
MEH INDEED!
-
Why’s everybody get so worked up here?
Ha, looks like I missed a luau. I like you too, Testify, we should drink together. Now, for the rest of you, if you’re so wrong about sock puppetry, why should I trust you on economics? It only indicates to me that you’re willing to junk reason to support your points.
I love how they digress into insults immediately.
I think FF and Diss are the same person. What say you, Steroid?
Who knows, who cares? When slugs are eating your garden, you don’t bother finding out their names.
self refelction isn’t a strong point is it… nor is ‘sense’…
TESTIFY!!
Hallelujah!
AMEN, bruthas!
I’m stupid? Anarcho-Capitalism ends in either monopoly or cartel. and you call me ‘stupid’… when you’re the one who shows again and again that you’re a cretin…
“Because god forbid you actually acknowledge our right to accumulate money in a free society …
collecting big tax refunds from our president since we’d make less than $250,000. Or we could be unemployed and get to take money from medicaire and social security instead of paying into it.”
`
So, bailing out the guys who took us over this cliff is not only OK in a “free society”, but their right; but bailing out some schmoe with unemployment after his company moved his job to Bangalore is… um… bad for some reason?
The “bailout,” and “stimulus package” distributed evenly amongst all US taxpayers (and only taxpayers) would come to around $11K per taxpayer.
That’s about a year and a half of monthly mortgage payments, from where I’m standing, or even better, paying off 20% of the remaining principal on my house.
(I actually LISTENED in my Economics courses and therefore saod ‘no’ to an adjustable-rate mortgage, preferring to buy a smaller place on a fixed rate I could actually afford. Where’s MY free money?)
Well, there is this barrel that you put your dick in and the snake in there bites it off. Your money is in the bottom of the barrel and you will need to use your dick to fish it out.
rofl. next time i get a question like that i’m going to try that on one of my clients and see how it works…
Use it with my blessing. I think it would be made all the more poignant for you to say that all and then say with a straight face that a crappily named dragon god told you this information.
I think the ARM forms should have said at the bottom of the paper, in fine print “Note: this doesn’t sign you up for any loan, it signs you up for mandatory attendance of a basic Econ/Finance course,” we would have been a lot better off
you don’t think that adjustable rate mortgage was enough of a give away?
i’m surprised no one has brought up negative amortization loans yet… those were the real killer loans out there… people really thought they had a mortgage with a 1% interest rate…
Depends on how it’s sold.
If you’re familiar with UK mortgage structures, they had a long sale of endowment mortgage. That was a laugh.
Sorry, slagg, you were smart and made a responsible decision. No soup for you!
Hey, if it’s any consolation, remember that you didn’t lose any sleep over spending within your means. I’m like you in that I made an incredibly frugal choice. In my case, I paid cash for a smaller house rather than having a mortgage at all. An acquaintance actually called me an idiot for not financing, because I could invest the money and get a higher return than the mortgage rate. At the time, he was probably right.
Since then, his company lost a major contract, and he has lost his Mazda X8 to repossession and had to sell his house.
When will we frugal folk learn?
Mazda *RX8, that is
Well, is your house worth less than what’s owed on it? If so, then there’s a HUD program that will let you cram down the debt. Just gotta look a little bit.
But what is a house worth when no one is buying?
my situation is different entirely – but i’d still love to get my hands on that $11k.
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i’m a 23 year old college graduate. graduated with 2 degrees in 4 years. i work full time for a health care company and own my own business in my “free time”. i have NO credit card debt, am overpaying on my school loans so that they can be finished before i’m ready to retire, have a paid off car, and pay all my bills on time (cell phone, etc). after college i moved home into my old room so i could save money and buy a house. i’m trying to buy a house right now and based on my budget i have enough saved to put down 20% downpayment.
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i can’t get a mortgage because i’m not a “safe” bet. yet my neighbor, a 37 year old grandmother who has bill collectors at her house every other week, just bought her second house. i know how much she bought for the house next to my parents, it used to be owned by my family… i know she put a bid in for a specific amount and it was accepted and then during the closing process she screwed them out of $15k of that bid.
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how the banks can rationalize giving loans to certain people and not others is disgusting. i never took an economics class, but i’m pretty sure having a credit score in the upper 700s, no extraneous debt (can’t avoid the school debt though), and a good savings should get me that mortgage i need. but no.
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/pissed off rant
Part of the problem is you’re 23. You don’t have much of a credit history. Try again when you’re 30 and you’ve got years of good payments to reference. Having a history of good payments on debts actually helps you get credit. Crazy, I know, but such is life. You might be able to take that 20% and buy a foreclosed property outright.
i’ve been paying my own bills since i was 18. yeah, it’s not 15 years of credit history, but it’s 5 years of history. which is why my credit score is in the upper 700s.
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i AM looking at foreclosed homes. and FHA 403whatever loans. i am more than qualified but the banks are too fcuking scared to give anyone loans that they’re not giving them to people who actually would be able to pay them back.
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and i’m looking to buy now, not when i’m 30 because by the time i’m 30 i intend on having a family. now i have the time and the funds available to purchase… when i’m 30 i’ll be too worn out from chasing kids and changing diapers to even want to think about moving. plus – strike while the iron is hot. i can get houses in my price range now… 7 more years and i’ll be another one of those people trying to buy houses that have over-inflated to the point where it’s impossible to purchase. and i’m looking to buy because renting is a scam. why on EARTH would i pay double what it really costs just so i can give someone else a profit, eff that. i’ll buy and pay at cost.
find a good FHA lender and get yourself a home… if you were in CA i could point out three or four different companies that would be happy to get you a good fixed rate loan…
can we trade our anonymous avatars for the ones at “totally looks like”? there’s are way cooler.
*theirs…
oi.
Steroid, it’s not your dime. You’re just borrowing it from the government. Every dollar in the country is theirs to do with what they please. If you don’t like it, go back to bartering.
Pissing. In. The. Wind.
If it was a real libertarian, they’ll argue for the reinstitution of the Gold standard, rather than the publishing house that is the Fed.
(The Fed publish mult-media relgious fiction… we just call it ‘money’)
reinstitution of the gold standard? why don’t we just go back to shells and colorful beads?
Clams. They’re at least edible.
Sorry, can you break a lobster? I don’t have any change.
LOL! Here’s a barnacle…
Chocolate chip cookies! Easily manufactured, portable, and if inflation becomes a problem, you just eat the excess!
Steroid might be printing its own.
Man, there are some characters in this place! Jaysus.
Thankfully nobody takes it personally, and everybody refrains from ad hominems, otherwise it might get ugly or something
When I think of the situation we are in today, I can’t help but think of the words “trust” and “monopoly”. Not in a literal sense, but a figurative sense, where these banks and insurance companies are using their power to control the masses of people who rely on them daily through money. It’s not so much a control to prevent competition from other companies, but more of the business’ upper echelons controlling their customers in such a way they will forever be indebted to them…I guess the best term to describe it is Corporate Indenturing using deception. These banks say “Oh, we can give you a loan to buy that house, even though we know it is over your head to pay it back with your income and credit at the time, and that being the case you will be paying us for the next 20 odd years, and our pockets will always be filled with cash.”
I don’t know, I just can’t put my finger on what to call it, or even how to explain it in words. All I know is it is wrong, and am not surprised that something like a populist movement would occur with these kinds of conditions.
I think it is called neo-aristocracy.
Seems the ‘roid has stopped commenting. Amazing what a combination of reasoned argument and gutter insults can do…
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